Gary Elkins Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Greetings! I recently "inherited" a 93 Del Sol. The body, wheels, tires, interior, etc. look to be in pretty decent shape. There is only one problem and, unfortunately, a big problem. It needs a new engine. So that leaves me with several choices. I can buy a rebuilt engine from Advance Auto for about $2,000. I have someone who will install it for about $300. Or, I can salvage it for scrap and get a few hundred dollars for it. Or, I can try to part it out, but that seems like it could be quite a hassle. Or I guess I could just sell it "as is" to someone who would like to invest in it. Has anyone else been in a similar situation? What would you do in my situation and why? Thanks in advance for any advice you have! Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick B. Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Hey Gary, Welcome to the forums first off. The del sol is a pretty sought after car in the honda world. I would suggest keeping it as a nice little project. Go ahead and get the motor and have it installed if youre not sure on how to do the work yourself. Answer some questions if you can; How do you know the car needs a new engine? Can you tell us a little history on the car? Do you know what engine the car has? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 9, 2012 Author Share Posted June 9, 2012 Hey Rick, Thanks for your response. I just spoke with my son (I inherited it from him) and he said he thinks it had the smallest engine for the Del Sol (1.4?). I can't check now because it is sitting at the repair shop where they are waiting for us to make a decision. Are there several different types of replacement engines, or only one? Concerning its history, when my son bought the car, it needed some engine work. For the repair, I think he went to a guy who cut a lot of corners to save money. So when my mechanic recently attempted to replace the timing belt, he could not access it because the crankshaft was bonded to the engine block by the previous repair - so he could not get to the timing belt. In short, the mechanic (a guy I trust) said it needed a new rebuilt engine (or a junk-yard engine). So I'm kinda in a situation where I like the look of the car, and I would be willing to invest some money into it, but I don't want to pour lots of money into a poor investment. I would like to think that either it would be a good long-term daily driver for me, or I could get some decent return on any money I invest to get it up and running again. My apologies btw- I am a true newbie as far as the Del Sol is concerned. Knowledge-wise, I'm starting from scratch. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airjordan223 Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Sounds like you have a del Sol s. This has a 1.5L D series engine. These engines are extremely cheap, I've seen them sold for a couple hundred dollars. So right now you have a lot of options as far as engines go. The great thing about 90s hondas is that they are built like legos, you can swap engines all over the place and they bolt right up. if you want to get the car just to run and back to stock, you could get a cheap d15, or if you want to upgrade and get a little more pep, you can look into a d16 or a B series motor such as a b16 or b18. If youre looking for some prices, check out hmotorsonline.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick B. Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 I would definitely look into other replacement motor options. The del sol is a great car to have, very reliable and good on gas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 $2000 for a stock original motor for it is pretty steep. You can find serviceable used original engines for that for under $200. The d15b7 (full engine code) in that Del Sol S was Honda's most common motor from 92-95. Every version of Civic CX, DX and Del Sol S had one. You can find higher output Japanese imported engines that drop right in and have mileages in the 30-50k miles range for $500-$800 but it will take a couple weeks to get it shipped to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 10, 2012 Author Share Posted June 10, 2012 Do you have any sources you would recommend that I should contact? $500-$800 sounds very reasonable for an engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 The ZC engine, imported from Japan most commonly comes in three versions - non-vtec sohc, vtec sohc and non-vtec dohc. The first two are similar to the american engines. the dohc is a unique one, it's clasified as a D series engine but has the B series dual cam. the d15b is a common one as well A SOHC ZC is available from any engine importer. You can install a non-vtec sohc version as a direct drop in but it's gutless. Will use the same computer, same mounts, same transmission. If you want to switch out your computer get the vtec sohc zc or the d15b vtec version for an engine that is just like the EX civics and the del sol si. hmotorsonline.com is the benchmark for imported engines, depending on where you live at there may be a decent company close enough to go and pick it up in person and save on shipping. I have a decent company, zerolift, in Cincinnati and they carry the zc engines dirt cheap. in all cases you need to make sure you get whats called an OBD1 engine, it has to do with your computer revision. Any of these importer places will talk to you on the phone to make sure you are getting exactly what you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 10, 2012 Author Share Posted June 10, 2012 Thank you, Xeryon. I went to your website and I see that you have a D15B OBD1,1.5 L VTEC SOHC 16v engine for $550. Do you also do a full swap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 If your transmission is in good condition you will not need a full swap, just the appropriate ecu (computer) for that engine for auto or manual. The supplier will be able to assist you if you call them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 I went to the garage this morning to find out some more about the engine. Here's what I found: It belongs to the following engine "family:" PHN 1.6 V5FTF5 Other numbers included: 93 FC and something about a displacement: 97 CID I didn't see any other info. I have no idea if these numbers mean anything. My mechanic thinks it might be a VTEC engine. I took some photos and will post them around noon (EST). In the meantime, do these numbers/letters mean anything to you? Thanks, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airjordan223 Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Next time you go, this is the location of the engine code on the block Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Your engine will look a lot different then the one in that picture though, but the engine ID plate is in the same place regardless. You might need to clean off 20 years of crud to see the numbers etched into the aluminum. Also take note of the small gold/copper colored - circular part to the left of the valve cover. In this pic it is just left and just up from center of the image. That is a vtec solonoid. Your car will also have one in roughly the same location if it is a vtec engine and I think they were all a goldish color. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 Okay, this is helpful. I plan to go back in about an hour and take another look. I will bring my camera this time - I had trouble uploading the photos I took with my phone. I should have pics and info by early evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 I now have some info and photos. The engraved code is D16Z6. There is also a set of numbers below the code: 2506909 What does this code mean? Below are links to two photos: https://plus.google....927188086160514 https://plus.google....927782338857282 Again, thanks in advance for your advice. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 12, 2012 Author Share Posted June 12, 2012 I did a bit more research and it seems that the D16Z6 is considered an inexpensive and less complicated option. Now, here is what I'm looking for. 1) I want an engine with plenty of pep (at least as much as my Miatas, if not more) 2) decent to good gas mileage 3) Total cost under $2,000 (including shipping and installation) 4) Installation that is not too complex and costly (my mechanic guessed around $800 - but it could be cheaper if the installation is not too bad 5) An engine that is going to last long term (preferably has under 100k) Is it possible to achieve all of the above? Which engine do your recommend? I'm getting excited about putting all of this together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 The d16z6 is the standard Del Sol SI, Civic EX or Civic SI Engine from 92-95 (97 for the sol) It ran about 130hp and 95-100 lbs of torque or so. Generally it was a pretty decent engine for it's time. 35-ish mpg for most people and just enough pep to be fun to drive. Was never going to win any races but enough to be spirited in cornering and such. Finding a z6 in good condition (low miles) is not cheap as it was the quick and easy engine swap of choice for all the other honda's with base model engines. The most direct, lower mileage engine you are going to find that directly matches your car is something like this: http://zerolift.com/...tec-sohc-engine It is a d15b, sohc vtec japanese engine. It is basically a rubber stamp of the z6 you have but slightly different head and timing to tweak for emissions at the time and distributed on a different hemisphere. Where do you live at? Might be able to point you in the direction of a more local distributor to save on shipping. And this d15b should be identical swap out for your z6. ignore the fact that the d15b is billed as a 1.5l and the d16z6 is a 1.6l, they are virtually the same displacement, just rounded differently for different markets. it should take any competent mechanic very little time to install. same as any other direct replacement. Just be sure to have them replace the timing belt, timing belt tensioner and water pump before installing it. Those things are regular maintenance on a honda of this gen and it's much cheaper and easier to do it out of the car. I would hope a d15b, shipping, timing parts and labor to install would run 1500 or less. If you mech would install the new one for $300 then the installation for this one shouldn't be much more aside from the timing belt installation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 12, 2012 Author Share Posted June 12, 2012 Thank you, Xeryon! So if I understand you correctly, I could go for the z6, but finding a low mileage one is very difficult. So the next best option is the d15b. We live about 1 1/2 hours north of Atlanta in the town of Toccoa (where the Band of Brothers did their training), in N.E. Georgia. I could go down to Atlanta to pick it up if necessary. In addition, Greenville, SC is only about an hour away. Do you sell the timing parts and water pump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 12, 2012 Author Share Posted June 12, 2012 By the way, on another forum, someone said that the B16A is a good option if I want to have a bit more hp. How much more expensive is this option? And how much more complicated is it to install? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Ut oh, I don't sell anything. I am just a happy contributor to the site. You should be able to get the timing belt and water pump from any parts store, like NAPA or Autozone or whatever you have in your area. When it comes to parts most of those things are the same bewteen the two motors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Well, it's hard to define unless you are a car guy. But let's just say it isn't something a novice will have an easy time with. A b16a is a great motor, they put a version of it into the 95-97 Del Sol VTEC model. 160hp, 120 torque I think. To install one you need the engine, transmission, edu, wiring harness and axles. Most places that sell the engines sell it as either an engine, engine and trans or a complete swap. When they mention complete swap it usually includes all the items I noted. To buy a complete swap from one of the vendors I listed above starts around $1700 plus shipping I think. Installation is a bit more. I would guess you are looking at closer to $3000 out the door to have someone else do all the work. (someone else please correct me if I am wrong) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrIaN EG2 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 2k for a rebuilt turd single cam = NO BUENO! go B or go home! lol too lazy to read all this lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Elkins Posted June 13, 2012 Author Share Posted June 13, 2012 Wow, 3k is more than I would want to invest in the car. I think it's back to the D16Z6 or D15B VTech. Xeryon, you mentioned that you may be able to point me to a source near my location. Do you have anything specific in mind? I called Automotix by the way and they did not have an engine below 100k and they would not warranty a D15b engine because they said it was not the designated engine for a Del Sol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrIaN EG2 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 hmotorsonline.com they have alot of great priced swaps for sale but theyre located in california.. if you ask me a B16A or a B18C1 is the best bang for your buck if you dont plan on modding the car at all and still want to have a little fun in the car.. single cams with no mods are just slow and boring, only thing stock singles are good for is MPG but thats still a hard to argue topic because i still got 30mpg highway with over 500hp.. i say for $1,000 extra *if you dont do the work yourself* its DEFINATELY worth it forsure, youll have alot more fun with the car than you would with a little d16z6 vtec or a SUPER slow d15b nonvtec.. and for doing the swap theyre extremely easy, ive done 4 swaps now myself and none have taken over 6 hours to take out the old power plant and swap in the new and have the car running.. the internet is your friend and there are PLENTY of writeups on how to.. i got my b18c1 from a friend and did all the work myself and my grand total came out to be 2100 for the whole swap: engine, trans, harness, ecu, axles, shiftlinkage, etc.. you can get axles from autozone, advanced auto, or oreillys for 65 each with a lifetime warranty, thats what i used for the longest time.. and if you do decide to go with a b series engine youll need to go to honda and order a shift linkage from them, your old linkage bushings and bolts work in the new linkage and your old d series motormounts work on b series engines as well.. everything with hondas in the 90s is interchangable thats what in my opinion makes them so damn great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 From my area there are three that are within a reasonable driving distance. From North GA Cincinnati might be worth the effort to drive. Give Zerolift a call and talk to their guys. Brian, when we were discussing we were talking about a d15b vtec, as in the one that is the twin of a d16z6. I agree with you on some points: as you approach 2k that is a lot of money to spend on a stock sohc motor, but I think with something like the d15b he can keep it under 1500, not have to get his hands dirty and get a lot more years out of his son's car. To spend more then that, or to install a higher HP engine then the sohc, is personal preference. I have owned my civic for 6 years now and have had a blast with it and it's never produced over 105hp in it's life and likely never will. I don't need to go fast. I just want it to handle really well and make me smile on the twisties. Any standard parts distribution is not going to have the motor you need. You will need to work with a place that specializes in performance imports. Service rates will be the same, just a different type of mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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