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Question about engine converstion


Blasianteen

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So hey you all, I am kinda new at the whole car thing, and I just had a huge issue that me and my friend are fighting about...

 

I need suggestions on what engine would be best for me to swap with on the del Sol I am getting soon.

 

My friend and I are stuck between a 05 RSX Type-s or a 00 Spec JDM Civic Type-R

 

I know my comments might be a little nubish but I am just a beginner needing some suggestions on an engine swap.

 

any and all help is appreciated

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well the K swap (rsx) is probably going to cost a couple grand more than the other. so whats your budget exactly.

 

No bugget really, it will just take me a longer time to save up..... :/

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No bugget really, it will just take me a longer time to save up..... :/

 

and the prices for the engines are:

 

05 RSX Type-S Complete Motor Conversion = $4,400.00

 

00 Spec JDM CIVIC TYPE-R COMPLETE CONVERSION = $4,500.00

 

I had also found this:

 

98 Spec JDM INTEGRA TYPE-R COMPLETE CONVERSION = $5,200.00

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i spoke with a guy the other day who had a very well running k swap civic.... he said 8-10k and it takes a good bit of work

 

 

8-10k for the motor 0_0

 

or does that include equipment, because I already have that

 

i spoke with a guy the other day who had a very well running k swap civic.... he said 8-10k and it takes a good bit of work

 

o. and I know this is one of those stupid comments

 

but whats a k swap ?

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well when your talking about swaps you normally go by engine.. not car

 

k swap would be swapping a kseries engine into the car

 

h22's are getting more popular to swap in.. cheaper then the k and a decent amount of base hp (like 220 i think)

 

b series (b16 b18 and b20) are really popular and a bit cheaper but still a good amount for like 160 hp

 

d series is what the car came with (d15 d16).. they are Single Cam motors (the others listed are double over head cam) and a lot of people hate on them but they are really good motors and actually are good building platforms because they have less to turn and are damn near bullet proof (no matter what other people say).. its pretty easy to get power out of them and they can be easily built for boost (you could do a turbo d for the price of some of the other swaps already mentioned)

 

but its really what are YOU looking for out of your car... if you don't know a lot about cars and are not used to handling cars with a bit of power.. something like a k swap may not be the best idea.. you could do a turbo d.. (check out turbod16.com) or an all motor d (check out d-series.org) and if you don't want a d series because you think its not good enough then a b might be good for you because it is done ALL THE TIME and there is A LOT of information out there about it..

 

and i know the guy had the tools and know how.. when you get into a swap like that the motor/tranny may be 4k but you have axles, ecu, wiring, mounts, etc

 

we dont know whats included when you say 'conversion'.. some include the axles and everything.. some dont.. and you have to consider fitment issues and what you'll have to cut/weld for some motors.. d and b series are basically drop in and bolt in

 

oh and you always going to run into problems which cost money to fix

 

and wiring is a MAJOR thing with swaps.. if you do not know how to do the wiring you will mess it up and i recommend taking it to someone who had wired it before.. which will cost you some money

 

so the 8-10k was after all is said and done and its running right (and you did a lot of the work yourself) its going to be a decent amount.. oh wait.. his was also a turbo k.. and built.. so it would probably be about 5-6k to do it if you do it yourself.. let me find crannys thread on his k swap... http://www.hondaforums.com/index.php?showtopic=26294 <-- that might show you what your getting yourself into

 

probably not the best swap for someone who doesnt even know what a kswap is (no offense)

 

i would look into doing a built d or a b

 

 

 

 

edit: YES i said he should think about b series.. the world will end now

Edited by DelSolSweetie
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well when your talking about swaps you normally go by engine.. not car

 

k swap would be swapping a kseries engine into the car

 

h22's are getting more popular to swap in.. cheaper then the k and a decent amount of base hp (like 220 i think)

 

b series (b16 b18 and b20) are really popular and a bit cheaper but still a good amount for like 160 hp

 

d series is what the car came with (d15 d16).. they are Single Cam motors (the others listed are double over head cam) and a lot of people hate on them but they are really good motors and actually are good building platforms because they have less to turn and are damn near bullet proof (no matter what other people say).. its pretty easy to get power out of them and they can be easily built for boost (you could do a turbo d for the price of some of the other swaps already mentioned)

 

but its really what are YOU looking for out of your car... if you don't know a lot about cars and are not used to handling cars with a bit of power.. something like a k swap may not be the best idea.. you could do a turbo d.. (check out turbod16.com) or an all motor d (check out d-series.org) and if you don't want a d series because you think its not good enough then a b might be good for you because it is done ALL THE TIME and there is A LOT of information out there about it..

 

and i know the guy had the tools and know how.. when you get into a swap like that the motor/tranny may be 4k but you have axles, ecu, wiring, mounts, etc

 

we dont know whats included when you say 'conversion'.. some include the axles and everything.. some dont.. and you have to consider fitment issues and what you'll have to cut/weld for some motors.. d and b series are basically drop in and bolt in

 

oh and you always going to run into problems which cost money to fix

 

and wiring is a MAJOR thing with swaps.. if you do not know how to do the wiring you will mess it up and i recommend taking it to someone who had wired it before.. which will cost you some money

 

so the 8-10k was after all is said and done and its running right (and you did a lot of the work yourself) its going to be a decent amount.. oh wait.. his was also a turbo k.. and built.. so it would probably be about 5-6k to do it if you do it yourself.. let me find crannys thread on his k swap... http://www.hondaforums.com/index.php?showtopic=26294 <-- that might show you what your getting yourself into

 

probably not the best swap for someone who doesnt even know what a kswap is (no offense)

 

i would look into doing a built d or a b

 

 

 

 

edit: YES i said he should think about b series.. the world will end now

 

 

Thank you a lot for your wisdom, its giving me a lot to consider. I am from an area were I have people who do stuff for me free and are good at what they do and will teach me how as we are doing it, so the only fee is the engine/ parts (kinda nice when you are friends with a lot of people, good or bad , but lets not go into that) as for the motor, I can give you the sight that I might purchase it off of, http://www.inlinefour.com/motors.html .

 

it seems to be reliable from what I can see. and comes with a lot of the parts that I need

 

As for my driving skills, I am a nub at the technically stuff, but I can drive, won a lot of street races... yes I do street race, but I also do legal drag strip, I prefer it because, A) its legal (thats about the best reason there is) but every now and then I need a little bit of money. But the cars I have done it with, because I am 16, they were never mine, (ooppsss :/) so power is exactly what I am aiming for since I have a lot of stakes on a race this coming spring and next summer at battle of the imports in capital race way MD.

 

At this point and time, it seems best that I go with a B swap because of price and switchablity (if thats even a word) But my only delema is I plan to keep this car for quite some time because being my real first project car, I really don't plan on selling it. So if I am pushing for the most power I can get but keeping the lovely look for the ladys (hahaha), I thought that the k series was my best way to go. correct me if I am wrong.

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i would look at some other sites and ask people you know where they got motors from.. you really need to be careful about where you get a motor from

 

 

street races dont mean crap.. street racing allows for A LOT of technical errors.. i know quite a few street racers who when they go to the track with us can't drive worth a damn and honestly the only place it matters is the track

 

i still think a b would be best but its up to you.. if you put TOO much power in a FWD car it just hurts more then helps on a dragstrip(which seems to be more of what you want to do).. you'll be wheel hoping and everything like crazy which leads to you BETTER have a good suspension set up on the car.. even with b you'll need a good suspension

 

you CAN get a lot of power out of a b if you do it right.. hell do it the easy way and build the motor and turbo it.. but until you get used to the car with more power just put the b in.. and then later on you can always rebuild it.. and always remember to TUNE YOUR CAR!!!! a great car can be a pile without a good tune.. aka not some kid with a laptop.. take it to a real tuner with a real dyno

 

IMO from what you've said a built b would be best for you.. if you get too much power it will be hard for you too race.. but whatever you pick you have to do it right.. you'll be able to do a b swap quicker too.. brian (member on here) had his b18 in in about 4 hours i think.. a k takes a lot more tweaking and a lot more wiring..

 

check out hmotors, japan star motors, and tiger japanese for motors.. a lot of them offer complete b swaps.. start using google and looking up b series motors

 

oh and one more thing.. if you want to learn to race keep it on the track.. you'll learn more from the people there then you would from a street racer.. if you REALLY want to learn how to drive.. save up for a driving school and learn how to autocross and do road courses.. you'll have an instructor in the car with you telling you the best way to do things.. straight lines are easy compared to taking turns AND straight lines

Edited by DelSolSweetie
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Thanks a bunch, I will keep everything that you told me in mind when choosing, though by the looks of it, a B series motor looks best at the moment. So I will probably do some research on that.

 

As for the racing, I will take into consider on the track, though I have had my good experiences taking turns and weaving in and out of traffic. But you can never get to much help, so I will try to find an instructor, do you have any in mind ?

 

And as for my Car, I would keep you updated on how everything goes, but I guess it would probably be better to just start a new topic when I actually get the car. hahaha (go figure)

 

Anyway, thanks again for the advice. o, and btw, out of curiosity, did you do an engine swap?

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i spoke with a guy the other day who had a very well running k swap civic.... he said 8-10k and it takes a good bit of work

VERY true story, friends been in the process of redoing his K20A2 swap in his 93 hatch... so far its ran him about $11,000.. but he's taking his time and buying the right parts and also doing a wire tuck

 

edit: YES i said he should think about b series.. the world will end now

OH MY FCUKING GAWD!!!! HELL JUST FROZE OVER PEOPLE!!!! :o

 

 

 

i say b swap because its cheaper, but if you dont have a budget go K, theyre QUICK in a del sol or a hatchback. i didnt like k swapped hatches and sols until i rode in my friends hatch and it took my breath away for it just having bolt ons (i/h/e, suspension work)

 

 

 

and i have a b swap in my sol, i LOVE it.. if you plan on doing boost dont get a ITR swap (b18c5) that engine has high compression and is better for N/A.. i say swap in a GSR (b18c1) thats what i have and its NIIICE, i love it :happy:

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its always nice to see a person who wants to get the most out of his car, and its great that you do alot of your racing on a track. we cant stop you from racing on the streets, but for your own sake and want for help. just dont mention the street racing u do and ull be fine.

'

there has been many members that get flamed away cause they wont stop talking about street racing....

 

 

and i say go be series..., just makes the car alot more fun. and trust me on this cause i have a b18c, there is always something else that needs to be fixed or bought, take you time, plan this built out and make sure that you are buying everything when you can afford it. dont make my mistakes

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As for the racing, I will take into consider on the track, though I have had my good experiences taking turns and weaving in and out of traffic. But you can never get to much help, so I will try to find an instructor, do you have any in mind ?

 

Anyway, thanks again for the advice. o, and btw, out of curiosity, did you do an engine swap?

 

weaving in out of traffic is not the same.. when racing on a big track you really need to know how to drive AND about your car.. you need to know how to set up your suspension and brakes and know your breaking points otherwise you'll probably see some grass and dirt lol.. im not sure where you live but a lot of road tracks offer performance driving days.. i live in SC and I know the owner of seat-time http://www.seat-time.com/html/main.htm its in GA but idk how far away it is for you

 

In your location it says NVA.. if that means Virginia then check out http://www.virnow.com/ if you want to see some driving go watch a race there.. and talk to as many people as you can.. you can learn a lot from people who have been doing it for years.. and most of them are going to be sponsored professional drivers so them and their teams know what they are doing (you can go to the 'the track' link and then go to 'how to get on the track' and it tells you different ways to get on the track with your car and also as a passenger)

 

racing on a dragstrip is A LOT cheaper then anything else.. autocross and actual course can get pricey with tires/brakes/entry fees but a driving school would really help anyone.. I plan on taking my next car i want to build to seat time just to get some track time in before i go to an actual event because you can go all out and not have to worry about anything but your driving (not have to worry about cops, other people one the road, potholes, debris in the road, etc)

 

I did a swap in my sol.. I only did the D16ZC which is the JDM version of the stock motor I had.. its my DD and I didnt want to do anything crazy even though I gave a lot of thought to a h22

 

My next car once i get my truck sold (swapped a mustang 302 in it).. is a 240sx with the RB25DET (single turbo skyline motor) Truck is dragstrip only and I want a 240sx so i can do more with it

 

 

there has been many members that get flamed away cause they wont stop talking about street racing....

 

 

and i say go be series..., just makes the car alot more fun. and trust me on this cause i have a b18c, there is always something else that needs to be fixed or bought, take you time, plan this build out and make sure that you are buying everything when you can afford it. dont make my mistakes

 

I think he knows street racing isn't good

 

listen to the plan it out part.. the WORST thing you can do is get what you want/need as you go.. research and plan out what you want and make a list and make sure you have EVERYTHING you need before you get started.. i think brian got hung up on his swap and couldnt drive it cause he had a shift linkage issue.. there is massive amounts of information on b swaps all over the internet and there are people with b swaps on here

Edited by DelSolSweetie
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I have been thinking alot about this in the best couple of days and the only real issue i have is how well is the K series

engine going to fit in the Del Sol, or am I going to have to make alot of space for it? I am very aware that I will have

to make an engine mount for it. but am I going to have to cut away anything?

 

And just btw, I am still leaning towards the b series , but I have alot of time to think about it so I am just trying to get facts down ?

 

O, and btw, What type of B series would be best?

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the k question: your going to have some work.. it will fit... but you can make just about anything fit with the right fabrication

 

a b will drop in without any real problems (should at least)

 

 

as for the BEST b for you.. I can't answer that because i can't choose for you

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_B_engine

 

 

^i would get to reading lol

 

if you want a turbo motor you may not want to go vtec (they can work wonderfully together if you have an amazing tune.. most people don't have amazing tuners)

 

if you want to build it n/a (naturally aspirated.. aka no power adder such as turbo or supercharger) then a vtec motor would be good.. i saw one at the track that when it hit vtec it screamed!! it was awesome.. i tried getting a vid but i couldn't

 

 

edit: I say read and judge for yourself because a lot of people will have a biased opinion (like brian will say b18 because he has one and loves it lol) but others who love their b16 will say go b16... not many people say go b20 anymore

Edited by DelSolSweetie
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honestly you could build the b for the price you'd be paying for the K

 

K swaps are cool and everything but i dont think you get much bang for the buck you know ?

 

go to hmotorsonline.com and go to the motor mall

 

b series ranging from 145 hp -200 hp ~$2-3k

 

K20 has 220 hp ~$4k to 5400

 

H22 has 200-220 hp for round about ~$2500 for the motor/tranny/ecu (they have some for 1k and some for 3200.. you'll just have to look through them all)

 

 

 

hell according to that crap do a h swap haha

 

you just need to start reading and do your research.. and don't forget about everything you'll need (including axles, tranny, wiring, ecu, etc along with replacing the timing belt/waterpump while its out)

 

i wouldnt JUST go by the prices i listed.. its a very general price list because im lazy and didnt want to look through all of it.. so go have a look yourself

 

and an h22 is always an option.. has the same power as a k with less money

Edited by DelSolSweetie
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Your last post shows that you need to do a lot of reading. Get on google and start searching. You need to do research for yourself. This will benifit you! Gather your own info and come up with a plan then ask questions , you will get answers. However you need to put your own time into research otherwise you seem lazy.

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Yeah right now the K swap is still somewhat complicated, but it is getting easier. For now you should just get the B and build it up for boost.

 

 

it may be getting easier but not much cheaper lol

 

when i could EASILY build my d for more power then the k has and spend half as much.. screw a k

 

i believe in 'bang for buck' i dont like over paying for crap.. even if it is cool

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i see your point but the way i look at it, you have your D, build it up, boost it, and youre running around what the K has for around the same money.

 

but now if you want more, what can you do? with the K you can now build it and boost, but the D youve already done that. Theres only so far you can go with the D before it starts to get very expensive and less reliable

 

when K swaps first started they didnt make mounts, and the shifter didn't line up. now they make kits for both of those so you dont have to custom fab stuff. probably in a few more years there will be more things to make the swap easier

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