Xeryon Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 So with a 14 year old, low milage florida car I expected lots of leaks and and stuff cause of dried out hoses and gaskets. Heres the fourth leak repair already: Water pump gasket is split. I already have the new water pump, wp gasket and a new timing belt in hand. Since I'm taking it apart this far I'm going to go ahead and replace the pump and belt since they are pretty cheap parts. Looking for any extra hints or pointers that someone who has already done this wants to give up. I already have tools, a manual, done lots of online research for how-tos and I have a clue, anything else you want to add? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 ive typed a how to many times on timing and stuff like this , and it never gets stickied , blame it on admin. tired of typing the same crap over and over. do a search for timing belt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 i know how cranny, I was just wondering if you had a comment or two to add to the typical auto manual how-to call it the veterans touch... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 follow directions to a tee if your using a manual. youl be good. dont pull on the tensioner to tighten the timing belt , very bad. your gonna have a hell of a time getting the crank pully off if its never been off and you dont have the tools. i use a 3/4 inch drive ratchet , and a pully holding tool i made from scratch that fits in the octagonal hole in the front of the pully. but , you can put car in 5th gear , clutch out , have someone stomp the brakes as hard as they can. use the biggest ratchet you can find , 3/4 inch preferably , ive broken at least 10 1/2 inch drive ratchets on crank pullys till i got a 3/4 inch drive. 19mm socket. 17mm on D series. use a long bar on the ratchet your using for more leverage. for axle nuts and pully bolts , i use 3/4 inch ratchet with 4 foot alluminum bar , lol. nothing stops me now , NOTHING!!! lol. impact guns are for lazy people , lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 i was looking at the impact guns the other day. I can get them for as cheap as $20 but they only have 260lbs of of force to them. Didn't know what amount of force would be generally needed for one. I kinda thought that the 1000lbs gun was a bit overkill, but I want to make sure that if I spend the money on one that it at least has enough balls to get the average nut off on the honda. I know what you mean on breaking the 1/2 drives. I severed a 18" 1/2" drive breaker trying to break loose the hub nut on the accord. No additional leverage needed. apparently my fat ass was enough force to do it. Cheap craftsman junk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrorocketeer Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 i use 3/4 inch ratchet with 4 foot alluminum bar , lol. nothing stops me now , NOTHING!!! lol. impact guns are for lazy people , lol. lol oh yeah? 9' piece of gas line on a 1/2" drive breaker bar didn't budge my axle nuts..... 1" drive impact gun, Plus soaking overnight in pb, plus heated to cherry red, before those sob's would budge. we broke 1 3/4" drive breaker bar, and a 1" bar at work trying to get some lug nuts off of a truck. the 1" gun didn't touch that shiat. we waited for the snap-on guy to come, so as we broke stuff, he would fix it. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 double post noob , lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 you know what x , even if it was a snap on breaker bar , you still would have broke it. breaker bars for nuts this tight , are FTL. people just put them on way too tight to begin with is the problem most times. 9 times outa 10 , if theres bolts or nuts you cant get off with tools that should get them off , is the result of a dummy putting them on with an impact gun. 1 3/4" drive? jesus man. nothing should be that tight , nothing. god bless the snap on dude , lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben. Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 Wow..so much talk of nuts and bars.. Just kidding, haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 i'm going tomorrow morning to get a couple tools I need to do this. Would you recommend a 3/4 ratchet with a 4' pole over an impact wrench? I'm going to get both either way, just not tomorrow cause I'm strapped for cash atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 well impact gun you need good compressor for it to run like it can. 3/4 inch drive ratchet good for any occasion , lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 i have a 20 gallon with a 6cfm flow rate, which is good enough for all but real long bursts from a gun. I probably will put my dollars towards the 3/4 and an array of larger metric sockets tomorrow. Like you say; it comes in handy for alot of things. how far can i improvise with not using a torque wrench? My thought was that I could mark the location of the nut and bolt and just match the marks back up when I reassemble to get a very similar torque rating. Didn't know how crucial the cam gears were as far as having extremely precise torque ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrorocketeer Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 1 3/4" drive? jesus man. nothing should be that tight , nothing. god bless the snap on dude , lol. lol thats supposed to be one, 3/4" drive breakerbar.... lol kinda all ran together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 its not crucial. you wont encounter anything that requires a torque wrench. they all have ratings yes , but just make sure they are tight. never overtighten man. same as cam gear bolts , make sure they are tight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastigir Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Good idea to go ahead and replace the tensioner pulley while you're in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRG7 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 ive typed a how to many times on timing and stuff like this , and it never gets stickied , blame it on admin. tired of typing the same crap over and over. do a search for timing belt. I've also said many times over, that if anyone wants something added to a stickied FAQ thread, to simply PM the link over. No one cares to do that, but they'll complain when something isn't stickied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 Good idea to go ahead and replace the tensioner pulley while you're in there. any particular reason why? I was never aware that it was a consumable part. the car only has 70k on it currently too.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastigir Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 any particular reason why? I was never aware that it was a consumable part. the car only has 70k on it currently too.... Because if it does fail, you'll wish you had replaced it when you had everything apart. 70k is close enough to 90k when it would be changed anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 23, 2007 Author Share Posted June 23, 2007 well I hadn't changed the pully cause I wasn't aware that it needed to be changed, that and its an hour and half drive to go to a parts store that stocks this gen honda parts. Everything is complete and I think my timing is off by a tooth or two. car is very sluggish at low rpm, only drove it about 1/2 a block and turned around. so how do I tell which way it is off? I followed the manual directions exactly and if it is off I can't be by more then 1 tooth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chubs Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 If your car jumped time do not drive it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 23, 2007 Author Share Posted June 23, 2007 yea, no crap Double checked my timings and I know how I got it off. Now the key is if I can correct it without tearing it all back down again. My crank pulley has four hash marks on it, three in a close spacing and then a fourth one about an inch further around on the pulley. There is a, for lack of a better term, scope on the timing belt cover that looks an awful lot like a timing reference mark. Question is, which of the four hash marks do I line up with? I already adjusted the timing to be inline with the middle of the three close spaced marks and the runs alot better. But without confirmation from someone with more knowledge then I have I don't want to drive it for fear of bad things. help me quick if you can, wife wants to go somewhere tomorrow and I don't want to have to drive the pickup on such a beautiful day. I've spent a couple hours searching for information on checking the timing, no luck for me so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 the one by itself on the pully , lines up with the pointer on the plastic timing cover dude. you must be looking straight down at the pointer , theres usually a sight like a gun , 2 reference points , the pointer , and a sight for you to put the pointer , if you follow. with the pointer good , thats TDC #1. your cam pully right now should have the spoke with the UP arrow , pointing ironically enough , UP , hehe. theres also little hash marks out each side of the cam pully , 90 degrees from the UP arrow. those align with surface of head for reference. now , if your crank is at TDC , and your cam is off , no worries , tear down not necessary. only a little. set engine to TDC take plugs out. take valve cover off. take upper timing cover off pull the rubber plug out of the timing cover under the engine mount use a ratchet and socket to crank tensioner bolt , 1/2 turn only. pull out on the belt firewall side of cam pully for slack in belt , than retighten tensioner bolt. now you should have slack enough to get your tooth either way your off , get it back on cam pully , its best when setting the timing , to have NO slack in between crank pully , and cam pully exhaust side while marks line up , youl have no problem that way. once you have them good , crack tensioner bolt again , remember keeping no slack between crank and cam pullys on front side. tensioner is spring loaded , BOOP , it will take up slack , lol. now , using the crank pully bolt , rotate the engine 1/4 turn counterclockwise , than tighten tensioner bolt , DONE. either way its off , it aint good , lol. but if its advanced a tooth , youl usually hear spark knock. if its retarded to far , it will be sluggish as hell. i say your retarded , hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 23, 2007 Author Share Posted June 23, 2007 ok, this is where I am at now. I screwed with it further. Having no one around for a quick answer I was just winging it. Like you said, obviously retarded, the timing that is. My problem was that when I installed it and went to use the auto-tensioner I had too much slack in the belt altogether and the one pulley spun a few notches before it cought. So I pulled it down exactly like you had already said, but before you said to do it that way. It would seem that aside from experience that I have a knack for figuring things out. Although I didn't know that was the access to the tensioner behind that plug, that would have made it easier. I just put the wrench on the crank pulley, lined up the belt and TDC and then spun the crank and it pulled the belt onto the cam pulley. I believe that I am perfectly on now, or at worse off by 1/2 a lobe, although I have no idea how. My guess is that the car was off before I even started as I wasn't the most responsive, even for a d15. Now that shes all done she runs liked a raped schoolgirl. Amazingly its much more responsive and she runs smoother and there is actually less tapping from the valves???. What would be the signs if the timing was advanced at all? I ran her really, really hard last night after everything sounded good idling and at low rpm in the driveway. (obviously after much listening and letting warm up and so on) and didn't hear anything that would sound like spark knock. I have never heard such a thing that I know of but I can guess that it would be easy to distinguish. I would assume that a decrease in fuel mileage would accompany being advanced? BTW Chubs, welcome back. Haven't seen you on in a while. After the 4th, maybe the 1.5 weeks after on that weekend I was attempting to get the other Ohio HF people to maybe meet up for a dinner. Not a special car meet, just saying hi to some people and puting faces to names. Seems like everyone is in cincy or me, so I could come to cincy or Dayton to make it a bit closer. BTW cranny, you are an honorary Ohioan and you are invited, I expect you to be there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranny Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 new timing belt can do more than people realize. good job dude. but your not finished yet , lol. get a timing light , start the car and allow it to fully warm up , fully. cross the blue 2 pin code connector at passenger floor. hook timing light up to car ,, look down the pointer and pull the trigger , this time well be using the middle of the 3 marks close together. make sure everytime that light flashes , the middle mark is exactly lined up to pointer. if its not , loosen dizzy bolts and adjust till you get it perfect. bang your timed to perfection dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeryon Posted June 25, 2007 Author Share Posted June 25, 2007 i will pick up the light and complete the job. in the short meantime, the car runs great there is no appreciable change in fuel mileage, but I do have a little white smoke from the tailpipe when I am under acceleration. Not enough that I noticed it myself, but someone following me pointed it out. Not a lot, just a a small puff under initial normal accleration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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